[GS] - Grievances Guide (2024)

Grievances Guide

Work in progress (need your help !)

What are grievances

Grievances are Gathering Storm's replacement for the warmongering system, It is meant to damage your relationship with other civs for being a warmonger while allowing space for the idea of retaliation.

You can see your current grievances with any other civ in the diplomacy panel and a log of all past grievances is available as well.

This guide is a collection of all the data I gathered on this new system.

Effect of grievances on relationship:

Personal grievances:
20% of their grievances towards you is converted to negative relationship
capped at -60 relationship

Grievances with other civs:
For every other living Civ they have met that you have aggrieved more than they have aggrieved you
calculate the difference between your grievances and theirs
10% of the sum of all those differences
capped at -40 relationship

note: Since grievances decay occurs for each civ individually, while 50 grievances with 6 other civs is the same as 300 grievances with 1 other civ for this calculation, the total grievances in the first example would decay 6 times faster.

Grievances per turn

Base

ancient: -10
classical: -8
medieval: -8
renaissance: -7
industrial: -6
modern: -5
atomic: -4
information: -3
future: -2

modifiers:

Grievances per turn are set to 0 while at war

Occupy their capital: 3 per turn
Occupy one of their cities: 1 per turn

note: these modifiers don't stack, if you have 5 cities it is only 1 per turn and if you also have the capital it is only 3 per turn.

Ibrahim's Capou Agha title: -1 per turn

Sources of personal grievances:

Personal grievances are grievances that only apply to one civ.

General:

denouncement: 25

refuse to make a promise: 25
cost per transgression if you do make a promise: 25

DoW against a city-state if they have at least 1 envoy: 50
DoW against a city-state if they are suzerain: 100

DoW:
Surprise: 150
Formal: 100
Joint: 100
Holy: 50
liberation: 0
reconquest: 0
protectorate: 0
colonial: 50
territorial: 75
golden age: 25
retribution: 50
ideological: 50
alliance: 0
emergency: 0

Cities:

Every city has a base value multiplied by a modifier based on casus belli.

The base value of a city is its population times 50/X. This value is capped at 50.

X is still unknown but right now the best guess is that it is based on the era and the era is based on the world most advanced civ in either tech or civics. I think it is also locked in place on the turn the declaration of war was made.

ancient: 2 (25 per pop)
classical: 3 (16.66 per pop)
medieval: 4 (12.5 per pop)
renaissance: 5 (10 per pop)
industrial: 6 (8.33 per pop)
modern: 7 (7.14 per pop)
atomic: 8 (6.25 per pop)
information: 9 (5.55 per pop)
future: 10 (5 per pop)

capture modifier(%) / Raze modifier(%)

Surprise: 150/450
Formal: 100/300
Joint: 100/300
Holy: 50/50
liberation: 100/600
reconquest: 0/0
protectorate: 100/300
colonial: 50/300
territorial: 75/150
golden age: 25/300
retribution: 50/200
ideological: 50/150
alliance: 0/300
emergency: 0/300

Note: For wars that have specific targets(example: liberation war) those modifiers ONLY apply to cities that meet the criteria, other cities are taken at formal war modifiers. Emergecies are an exception to this, its modifiers apply on all cities.

Peace treaty:

Cede: Same amount as the grievances incurred for the conquest (effectively doubles your grievances per city)
Return: Negative grievances equivalent to the grievances incurred for the conquest (net 0)

Sources of global grievances:

Global grievances refer to an action that incurs grievances with all other civs assuming they have met you.

Due to the way relationship modifiers are calculated, this can lead to extreme negative relationship with everybody if there are a lot of civs in your game but it will go back to 0 very quickly.

Take a civ's last city: 300% of that city's base value
Capture a city-state: 50
Liberate a city-state: -32

note: if upon the conquest of a civ's last city you pick the liberate option, there will be no penalty for eliminating that civ

Shared grievances:

A percentage of grievances are shared with friends and allies, only grievances related to war are shared.

ally: 50%
declared friends: 25%
defensive: 25%

note: if you eliminate a civ, all occupied cities will be instantly ceded for the purpose of shared grievances (see peace treaty section).

Summary for warmongers:

1. Civ is the target of an emergency for capturing a city you can liberate
action: join the emergency, take everything and then liberate the last city
result: no grievances, not even to the Civ you are wiping out

2. Civ has a city you can liberate
action: take everything and then liberate the last city
result: 100% with target, 25% grievances with friends, 50% with allies, 0% with everybody else

3. Civ has no city you can liberate but has a city you could loyalty-flip
action: take everything except 1 city that you can loyalty flip.
result: 100% with target, 25% grievances with friends, 50% with allies, 0% with everybody else

4. Civ has no city you can liberate and you couldn't flip any single city if it stood on it's own
action: keep the city with the lowest population for last
result: 100% with target, 25% grievances with friends, 50% with allies, population-dependant grievances with everybody else